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lurecrafter
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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Been a while since I posted on NYBASS. Didn't know about the new design.
In any case, my reason to fish has changed since I last posted. Making and testing new designs is my obsession - regardless the species. In fact many lures get bit by 5 species of fish including bass. No point in being selective of the strike since you still never know what is hooked or how large. Granted, large- and smallmouth are still welcome on the larger plastics I pour or modify, but I don't mind the pull of 13" crappie, 10" yellow perch and sunfish bigger than my hand!

Good thing I can duplicate most lures in plaster (molds) or find most on eBay, but as many know from having fished with me, I'd rather the lure be unique in shape, action & size in combination than what I've cast before. Variations of design tell me a lot about what fish strike and maybe why. Whether they catch fish in my pond or in local lakes, most important is that they do.

Here are a few examples I can count on in waters 15' or less:



Who knew a jig trailer rigged on a light 1/8 oz ball head jig could catch bass?!

Joker tail added to a segment of French Fry stick:


Of course what was the first fish it caught when tested for the first time?




There are hundreds that have done well - none in their original shape and/or size. ACTION SPEAKS LOUDEST when it comes to fish strikes - no exceptions!

Note:
Got rid of the bassboat and do quite well from my 12' Jon in smaller local waters than Orange L., which is coming back after the devastation of 3700 hybrid carp introduced by the homeowners to get rid of weeds. I'm sure MikeD remembers how it was after the video he posted. Too bad the DEC didn't have a clue the potential damage without finding out the lake's average depth was only 12' and didn't need weed control. Been getting a few good reports though and may start testing my lures there again soon.
FrankM
 

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Been a while since I posted on NYBASS. Didn't know about the new design.
In any case, my reason to fish has changed since I last posted. Making and testing new designs is my obsession - regardless the species. In fact many lures get bit by 5 species of fish including bass. No point in being selective of the strike since you still never know what is hooked or how large. Granted, large- and smallmouth are still welcome on the larger plastics I pour or modify, but I don't mind the pull of 13" crappie, 10" yellow perch and sunfish bigger than my hand!

Good thing I can duplicate most lures in plaster (molds) or find most on eBay, but as many know from having fished with me, I'd rather the lure be unique in shape, action & size in combination than what I've cast before. Variations of design tell me a lot about what fish strike and maybe why. Whether they catch fish in my pond or in local lakes, most important is that they do.

Here are a few examples I can count on in waters 15' or less:



Who knew a jig trailer rigged on a light 1/8 oz ball head jig could catch bass?!

Joker tail added to a segment of French Fry stick:


Of course what was the first fish it caught when tested for the first time?




There are hundreds that have done well - none in their original shape and/or size. ACTION SPEAKS LOUDEST when it comes to fish strikes - no exceptions!

Note:
Got rid of the bassboat and do quite well from my 12' Jon in smaller local waters than Orange L., which is coming back after the devastation of 3700 hybrid carp introduced by the homeowners to get rid of weeds. I'm sure MikeD remembers how it was after the video he posted. Too bad the DEC didn't have a clue the potential damage without finding out the lake's average depth was only 12' and didn't need weed control. Been getting a few good reports though and may start testing my lures there again soon.
FrankM
Orange is really starting to rebound. Last weekend had a few 3-4 lbers, including a few smallies.
 

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lurecrafter
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296 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 · (Edited)
Orange is really starting to rebound. Last weekend had a few 3-4 lbers, including a few smallies.
A fellow member said the same thing except about catching some very large crappie. Guess I'll have to try the 2.5 hp Merc pretty soon. Smallies? Wasn't aware there were any in Orange L. None have ever been stocked and none are native. Must have been someone chucked them in.

Mike, It was a blast that day with you on board with your cameraman and you made filming less stressfull - minus my nervous tension. Course the retakes were a pain! LOL Didn't matter though - the bass were cooperative.
 

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glade to see that you are still enjoying the hobby of making lures, Buddy!!!
 

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lurecrafter
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296 Posts
Discussion Starter · #6 · (Edited)
Better than that John is finding what it is about various lure actions - lures made or bought - that excel.

i.e. the Senko - a soft plastic stick that uses a plastic formula that sinks when it drops horizontally at a certain rate, causing the tips to quiver.

My discovery based on the Senko design: a mini-stick I made, weighted in the middle using a jig head. Same tip action, same overpowering urge to strike on the drop. Thank You GY!

Remember Uncle Josh's pork frog, skirted jig trailer? (Why it had the name of frog I'll never know.) Well, I assumed at the time that 1. it could only be used with a skirted jig to catch bass and 2, the jig could only be effective worked off bottom.

Granted, the skirt does add a billowy motion, but then what's the trailer do?
Answer: the triangular flaps at the rear of the trailer flap and flutter. Add the billow of the skirt and you have one H of a bass lure. But only on bottom?
Discovery: I was reeling in a j & p at the same speed as a spinnerbait - horizontal to the bottom in 7'near rocks
A 2 lb bass struck and was caught! Whoever thought a jig & pig could be worked like a spinnerbait?! Caught more bass doing the same retrieve in other areas of the lake. Still didn't know why until I remembered the trailer's leg flutter.

Years later I had a similar copy of the frog trailer made in plastic just sitting around (the one pictured in the original post above). Retrieved it on a plain ball head jig and caught a 2 lb bass! So much the need for the skirt on a jig! The trailer had the same flat wide body/ thin fluttering tails. That's all she wrote!

I will still cast skirted jigs of course with different trailers, but now know that different trailers can be used alone to catch bass.

No one I know takes any interest in why some lure designs work so well. It's my obsession and challenge regardless of fish species and I treasure each discovery.
 

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lurecrafter
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296 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 ·
You discovered a couple of decades old baits: wacky jig and swimming a jig.
I've used the original baits for over 40 years never thinking of the reasons they caught bass. If fish don't always attack lures to eat them, then there have to be other reasons such as those related to lure design. Knowing those reasons allows me to separate lures according to what they do in the water and how good they do it.

BTW:
Wacky mini-stick ; swimming a trailer with or without the skirted jig. I've never heard of anyone swimming a skirted jig and trailer much less just the trailer.

We've discussed a topic like this in the past and unless there's a new side to the conversation, not much point in beating a dead horse.
 

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Crass Angler
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I was wondering why you think you discovered wacky jigs and swimming jigs, when both have been around decades. What's the real point you're trying to make?
No one I know takes any interest in why some lure designs work so well.
Almost everyone I know is interested in this, including you. You take it a step further and tweak things. If we had all the answers to our questions that start with "Why...?" we'd know it all.

By the way, do not put a chunk trailer on a drop shot rig - it doesn't work. And if you do, definitely don't slice it in half to reduce width profile because that would be dumb. Smallmouth hate it.
 

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lurecrafter
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Discussion Starter · #10 · (Edited)
I was wondering why you think you discovered wacky jigs and swimming jigs, when both have been around decades. What's the real point you're trying to make?
When was the last time you swam a jig trailer on a jighead? Who do you know that has - especially this one?:

Fact: many fish species strike it - not only bass. You fish for bass only / I fish for whatever strikes my lures, but it has caught bass up to 2 lbs.


You are forced to use lures right from a package/ I don't. If I want to downsize a design, I usually can - no different than adding a skirt to a lighter jig or spinnerbait or changing trailers for bass. Again, downsizing sometimes gets even larger fish to strike much less a larger size range of fish. This a wacky-rigged stick that catches 5 species:


This was the first mini-stick I discovered and it caught many fish in different waters but required a jig head for proper fall rate and tip action (which a Senko doesn't):

It led to the other sizes and shapes thereby expanding both.

This cone tail stick has caught many fish including bass in different sizes (note the clear tail):

In the above example, the concept of a no-action-tail grub, stick or plastic worm, isn't common for most anglers that must buy lures. But just because a curl tail is missing doesn't mean the lure doesn't exhibit a unique action fish respond to when worked mid-depth. MikeD was a witness to this years ago when we fished a local lake using some of my modifications. The point of all this is that on any given day many lure types may work - some better than others.

It would pay to reread the last reply for details that you seem to be missing as well as the above key points. Lure craft is not only about copying lures or changing a surface appearance. It's a whole lot more and takes into account fish senses and reactions based on those senses to different lure actions and vibrations.
 

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Crass Angler
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I learned to put any plastic bait, jig trailer or whatever else, on a jig head from my grandfather in the 80s. People already did this with grubs and jig worms, going back even farther. As plastics designs expanded, so did what we put them on. I even remember putting an actual Uncle Josh pork frog on a ball head as you pictured above. I wouldn't call that chunk trailer no action. When retrieved, the tails flutter subtly, much like a flag hung horizontally would in a calm breeze. Swimming baits on a jig is nothing new. Now look at the explosion of so called ned rig baits built around a technique invented in the midwest out of the idea of reusing broken senkos. The hoopla is a little silly, but the "poop jig" is here to stay.

Wacky Jigs came out around 2005/6. Before that, when it became too windy to keep a wacky rigged plastic down I would pinch a small weight on to preserve that ROF of a senko on a calm day. On a calm day, it affected the ROF as well as that wiggle action you spoke of. I discovered that with a little weight, plastics that performed poorly wacky rigged, suddenly worked really well with a bit of weight. Once articles about "flick-shaking" came out, and the wacky jig - a weighted hook with a straight shank was available - this was even more convenient. Funny thing about the "flick shake" on a wacky jig for me is I don't find I need to impart that flicking that was described in the articles coming out of Japan. I already knew the best baits had their own wiggle.

I can appreciate that you've picked up on the nuance of plastics, but to say that no one does this or that you made some discovery that no one else has is a little over the top.
 

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lurecrafter
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Discussion Starter · #12 · (Edited)
I can appreciate that you've picked up on the nuance of plastics, but to say that no one does this or that you made some discovery that no one else has is a little over the top.
You and I are the exceptions - not the rule - when it comes to innovation and trying new things. Good to know someone else observes, is detailed and open to experimentation beyond what the media (especially BassMaster Magazine) touts as the best way to catch bass or anything else for that matter. It may keep things simple but limiting when it comes to versatility which is the reason I dump the mag in the garbage without reading new issues. YouTube vids are no better. Commercialization of the sport wasn't unexpected much less the emphasis on winning money and fame - little of which applies to the weekend angler.
Unless you have some new ideas to present helpful to the average angler such as those I presented, I don't see the point of continuing the conversation with you unless you have something useful that confirms or expounds on those ideas.

BTW I never said the trailer had no action with this statement. In fact just the opposite:
My statement:
Granted, the skirt does add a billowy motion, but then what's the trailer do?
Answer: the triangular flaps at the rear of the trailer flap and flutter.

Your criticism based on ignoring that statement :
"I even remember putting an actual Uncle Josh pork frog on a ball head as you pictured above. I wouldn't call that chunk trailer no action. When retrieved, the tails flutter subtly, much like a flag hung horizontally would in a calm breeze."
and
"I discovered that with a little weight, plastics that performed poorly wacky rigged, suddenly worked really well with a bit of weight."

...and how many anglers do you know that have done that or where have you posted that idea?

It pays to carefully read what is written rather than make things up to prove a point or to criticize the presentation (nothing new in all the years of negative replies.)
 

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Crass Angler
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...and how many anglers do you know that have done that or where have you posted that idea?
I see posts from other anglers weekly. You're underestimating the average avid level angler. I think I must have misread your statement on the trailers. Mea culpa. I don't think my replies have been negative. It's important to be critical of everything, even amongst friends.
 

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was enjoying that too much to interfere....felt like old times! LOL......two intelligent anglers , looking at things from their own logical perspective , and both of whom are used to success.
 
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