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Fisherman & Grand Pa
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Jesus Christmas ... did you all see the hoopla over this hunt.. I drove past Wawayanda State Park like I do twice a day and there was 4 troopers parked at the entrance and on the way hone yesterday a NYC channel 4 news truck headed out.... Thank God that crap dosent happen in NY
 

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Got smallmouths???
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Warwick,

I've been listening to a NJ radio station located in Sussex and they are always giving updates on what is going on with the bear hunt, the animal rights groups kind of won the fight on this a bit due to the fact that they got to stop the hunt in the Delaware River National Park area in NJ.

What NJ doesn't understand we here in PA. are purposely sending the bears there to get rid of the PETA over population problem NJ is having, if a few bears eat a few PETA members no more problem:D
 
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Well...There is always another viable solution

Chemical sterilization....
I am not against hunting and have so in the past...BUT the fact that the overpopulation has gone unchecked and we now have a total OPEN season fuels the fire to the Anti movement.
The fact that Male/Female and CUBS are OPEN is a little much...

I for one could not put a bear cub in my sights and pull the trigger. Before anyone jumps down my throat for that statement...You are a better Man/Woman than I if YOU can.

Woody
 

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1,252 Posts
Come on Woody you can't be serious about the chemical sterilzation? Sows w cubs are open?

There is a preset number from 160 to 300 or so. They can and will shut it down when they get the "correct" number.

I couldn't pull the trigger or shoot an arrow at a bear and I've had several good oppurtunities. Just finding and seeing them was enough for me. I spent weeks gathering bait for a bait station under a tree stand and finally had a decent bear come in and couldn't draw the bow. Of course this was after I had already passed up several with my rifle in previous seasons.

Scott,

The fact they couldn't hunt on federal property just proves the state game dept didn't jump through the federal bureacratic hoops. They could get it done given enough lead time and budget. They probably knew it would get blocked, but they went for it.....really a cost effective approach.


Paul
 

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OUTCAST BASS ANGLERS
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This something that has to be done. Chemical sterilization? How are we supposed to do that? Our towns and states Are making budget cuts across the board not to mention cutting school programs, so who is gonna pay for that? I say we take all these anti- sportsman and make them pay for it. I could just see the planes flying over head spraying chemicals to sterilize bears. Sounds great dont it. Where I vacation in Sullivan county the bears are no longer scrared of humans. At night you can here them throwing the garbage cans around trying to find food. Remember these morons are the same ones that think fishing should be banned!

Jimmy
 

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Got smallmouths???
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Good Idea but doesn't work

Woody,

Chemical sterilization has been done in the past in other states, trying to keep the population of both deer and bear at a managable levels, unfortunetly unless you either force feed or even tranquilize every bear in Northern NJ and the give them a shot it is not going to work.

Many of the problems due to bears in West Milford were and still are because of people, the "Oh look at that cute bear, he must be hungry, I will put food out for him" was one of the biggest mistakes many of those people made. Feed one bear, he is going to keep coming back, problem there is, are you sure your feeding the same bear, now you have multiple bears that have become accustomed to humans, and bears will bring friends with them if the food supply is plentiful.

Another problem is the over developement in Northern NJ, this is about the only thing me and the animal rights groups will ever agree on. Take a ride just down the road from you in Franklin Lakes and Mahwah, when my dad was growing up there they had bear living in the heavily forested areas and back in the mountains, most of the land there was either forest or farm land. Now you have houses in the million dollar plus range, condos in the half million dollar range.

The loss of habitat is not the bears fault it is the fault of developers and politicians they have put NJ into a dangerous situation that now only the hunting of full grown and cubs alike can only solve. For years the NJDEP had reported to the politicians in power and asked for a limited hunt, I remember those debates back almost twenty years ago, usually the animal rights groups would fight it off as many did not want to see the bear season open back up again, many did not believe that the bear population was growing that fast. I remember taking a hike with a friend to scout of an area he was going to deer hunt in West Milford, on the way back through the woods he pointed out a couple bear dens, not more than a mile or so from houses and roads, this was back in the mid 80s. Land developers have gobbled up much of the open and forested lands in a state that boasted "Industry and still two thirds forested" although again thanks to politicians for allowing it to happen.

I remember also in the mid 80s seeing my first wild bear, right in my hometown of Haledon, NJ, for those that don't know Haledon boarders Paterson, Wayne, North Haledon and Propect Park, NJ, it lies about 30 miles southeast of West Milford. The local town POs didn't know what to do, whether to shoot it or let it go, it most likely was a young male pushed from the den by the mother or just a young male in search of a mate.

I doubt you will hear that the hunt was all that successful, with this snow storm the bears should have gone into hybernation, putting them in their dens and making them much more scarce.
 
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Paul..Yes, I am

Jimmy....I don't think spraying from airplanes is what they had in mind:rolleyes: .
Paul, the numbers you and I have heard differ a wee bit...I have heard 500+ in the Waywayanda area.
I will never forget fishing that body of water and spending several minutes spying a bear in a tree as he was spying me...Probably one of the coolest things I ever saw...
Oh well...Blast away
Woody

Paul the report I heard was EVERYTHING is open...including Cubs
 

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Woody, Dont put anything past these people. go look at one of PETA's websites and you will see what there capable of.

Jimmy
 

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Fisherman & Grand Pa
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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
DAMN DID I OPEN A CAN OF WORMS..... lol...
I tell you, I live in warwick (Obviously hence the name) and live 5 minutes from Wawayanda St park. and I walk through there alot in the past 20 years since moving from Brooklyn, and in the last 2 years I have seen more bear in and around the park than ever before I could write VOLUMES of happenings regarding bears that wander from the park.. Hell I travel Clinton Rd twice a day and see some HEFTY bears at least twice a week,, I have plenty of photos ...

I own several rifles and do not hunt but believe in the desire as well as the need to thin them out BEFORE someone really gets hurt besides some numbskull jumping on the back of a 300lb plus bruin just to save his dog. or a hiker getting her back pack torn open for her lunch..

I'll try and post some pics in a bit...


tight lines Ken
 

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I hear you Woody

I had one of them animal rights people try to throw perfume on me as I was walking into a deer check station. Damn moron scrared the crap out of me as I didnt see him coming. This was on Long Island deer hunting years ago.

Jimmy
 

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Am I reading this thread correctly? That prior to this Jersey had no open season on Black Bear? If so that is nuts and irresponsible. I haven't walked the woods with a rifle in 10 years, but the bears in NY were becoming far too numerous then, I can imagine how they have spread. And if in NY why not Pa and Jersey?
I myself could not shoot a cub, and have no desire to bear hunt. But if I did I would have no moral problem taking one. Its the hunters job to keep these and other animals in check, both for our and their own good.
A couple of years ago we were shooting geese on a golf course in Westchester. I say shooting cause it certainly wasn't hunting, but these birds had reached vermin status and had to be removed. They weren't endangered and they weren't cute. They were freaking disgusting.
If the bear population has outgrown its boundaries they need to be thinned and hunting is the most selective and viable way.

Just a thought... If you shoot the Sows, will the cubs live through the winter, or will they starve to death?

Broadbill
 
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Scott

I missed your post and of course as always you were right on...I think I am pissed that I too heard of the hunt 20 years ago and TOTALLY understand management of the species.
When developing gets in the way of anything...anything usually suffers.
I think my point was the disdain I have for local politicians who let this get to this point..
I know seeing people chant cub killers into microphones and cameras is not the best for hunters.
Not living to far from Waywayanda and knowing and hearing about the problem for years has caused me to become jaded on the subject.
The first day 61 were harvested... 2 Males going over 500+ pounds...One Female...and the rest average males.
The problem I have is that we look like anything but sportsmen.
Warwick....My In-Laws live in Ringwood and have frequent visitors...They think it is pretty cool to watch them from a distance.
On the other hand, I wanted to introduce my children to Backpacking/Camping last year and Waywayanda was bypassed because I do not or could not have permission to carry.
Woody
 

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Fisherman & Grand Pa
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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Woody.. .I'm heaily involved in Scouting here in Wariwik and when the Scouts are involved I try to stay clear of Wawayanda just because of how dense the bear population is/was. we'll see now..
and yes it's been 30 years since a bear hunt was allowed in NJ ..
Tight lines.. Ken
 

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NJ can't keep track of the foster kids in the state, how are they going to sterilize bears on a yearly basis? It's just a nutty idea. I didn't say it couldn't be done, but who is going to pay?

The hunters pay with license fees to harvest bear and provide a benefit to society in the process at little to no cost to the taxpayer.




Judge Allows N.J. Bear Hunt Into Rec Area

Tuesday December 9, 2003 3:16 PM


By KRISTA LARSON

Associated Press Writer

TRENTON, N.J. (AP) - A judge on Tuesday lifted an order that had closed a sprawling national recreation area to bear hunters, as the state's first open season on the animals in more than three decades went into its second day.

On Monday, the first day of the new bear season, hunters bagged 61 bears, the largest weighing 498 pounds, the state Department of Environmental Protection said.

Officials hope the hunt will reduce the state's population of an estimated 3,200 bears by about 500 to stem the rising tide of complaints about the animals breaking into suburban homes, raiding trash cans, killing livestock and wandering into traffic.

U.S. District Judge Reggie B. Walton lifted a temporary restraining order that had kept hunters out of the Delaware Water Gap National Recreation Area.

Walton, in Washington, had issued the order Friday in response to a complaint filed by environmentalists opposed to the hunt in the preserve, which covers nearly 70,000 acres along the Delaware River.

``We think this is a horrible decision, and the very small population of bears in the Delaware Water Gap park are going to be placed in jeopardy this week,'' said Michael Markarian, president of the Fund for Animals, one of the groups that had sought the restraining order. They had argued the National Park Service should have conducted an environmental assessment before allowing bear hunting there.

Opponents of the hunt elsewhere in New Jersey chanted ``Stop the slaughter, save the bears'' Monday as they held a rally near a weigh station at Wawayanda State Park. They also took to the woods with video cameras to monitor the hunt.

The state opened up 1 million acres for the hunt and issued some 5,200 permits.

Bears were hunted annually in New Jersey from 1958 to 1970, when hunting was suspended because their numbers dwindled to about 100.

Black bears have killed eight people over the past three years in North America. No one has been killed in New Jersey, but a homeowner was mauled by a bear in May when he went to the aid of his dog.

Lynda Smith, director of the Bear Education and Resource Group, said her group has tried to teach northwestern New Jersey residents how to avoid close encounters with bears by keeping garbage can lids on tight and not leaving pet food outside.

``One week of bear hunting, nothing's going to be solved,'' Smith said. ``Come spring, the bears will still be eating our garbage and still be walking through our back yards.''

Harry McDole bagged what conservation officers said was the first bear of the season just before 8 a.m. Monday, a 160-pound female. McDole, 63, of Sussex Borough, said he had killed three bears in Canada on previous hunting trips.

``I've waited 33 years to shoot one in New Jersey,'' Dole said. He said he planned to have ``a rug or something'' made from the pelt and eat the meat.

^---

On the Net:

N.J. Fish and Wildlife: http://www.state.nj.us/dep/fgw/
 

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Protect the 2nd Amendment
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Scott hit the nail on the head..."OVER DEVELOPMENT"...and I'm sure many of the anti's are living in the new homes where the game use to inhabit...

If New Jersey say's it's ok...being so liberal and so damn anti-gun and anti-hunt...it must be a problem...

...Not many cheaper way's then a bullet...
 

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Got smallmouths???
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3,200 down to 500 bears

Paul,

I am sure that NJ has kept a better eye on the bears than the foster kids in Newark, NJ, but I think they are smoking something if they think they are going to thin the bears to 500, maybe DYFS(Department of Youth and Family Services) is doing the counting.

Broadbill,

In 1970 the bear population was deamed in danger of extinction in NJ, but if you have 100 bears, maybe a third of them males, the following year you may have somewhere between 150 to 200, bears usually have twins, double that every year for thirty years, minus a few dying every year to disease, age and or accidents with cars, you had a bear population out of control. Again, the NJDEP tried for the past 20 years or so to open a limited bear season, unsuccessfully until this year.

No Luck,

I grew up in Passaic Co. NJ, lived there for almost 16 years of my childhood, watched my little hometown go from a total population of 2600 to over 10,000 in just a decade before I got out of HS.....houses and condos were being built monthly at that time.
 

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Scott,

You read but did not understand. 3200-500 = 2700 bears left. I still think that I saw a figure of 160-320 or so in another paper.


Paul
 
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Paul...Thanks for the research

I also heard via "The News" on 1010 about the numbers I came up with in a special report.
They interviewed several people Anti's and Hunter's alike.
Unfortunately they has a spokesperson for the Anti's who had a well written public response and then a couple of regular guys who were hunting.
I am sure the DEC will come up with the exact numbers at the conclusion of the hunt.
Woody
 

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Fisherman & Grand Pa
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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Either way you look at it, the hunt was needed. And hopefully I won't see bear marching through the center of town like I did last year..
 
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