Posted by JOHN G on 2002 AM:

You Tourney Guys never cease to Amaze me!!!

ask a question about culling ( note all the replies) or live wells or anything of a boat constructive nature and the replies will pile on, but ask anything about specific techniques or stategy and you all clam up like crazy!! LOL......

Woody's excellent post about fishing from the back seat went mostly unanswered....

My challenge to all the guys in my eye catching "you are all wimps" post has yet to elicit a single response from an actual winner of any tournament with any details about what and how etc......

surely, over this winter you will give that little competitive demon a rest and share a little?

JOHN G

__________________
"and a new Commandment I shall give you.....that you shall love one another"
---------------------------------
> email - DrBass2@aol.com
> Forum Moderator aka: Head Honcho
---------------------------------
Quote: "coming soon"
---------------------------------

Posted by earthworm77 on 2002 AM:

John, only certain tournament guys are quiet about everything they do. In my club, we share info readily. I've been out there and gave patterns and baits that were working for me that particular tx to other competitors. It means little to me to win or lose. I'm just out to have fun. I can't see the logic in gettng pissed off and jealous at another guy for winning 100.00. If you are in tournaments for the money, you better be damn good to make it worth it. If not, your wasting your time. My reasons for tournament fishing are and were different from the begining. I knew I had a serious but unorthodox approach for my fun fishing and I wanted to see if I could win with it. I proved to myself that my approach was not a fluke and that going against the grain of standard practice wsas worth it.

__________________
www.micromunchtackle.com

Posted by Scott C on 2002 PM:

John,
I did notice that myself and laughed. Like when someone gets whacked by the mob no one seen a thing !

I fished TX this year for the first time. It was an interesting transition to say the least and was a bit nerve wracking at times. Especially in the begining when the clock was my biggest opponent. I got over that and then it was the other fisherman. After a while I realized that I wasnt trying to catch the other fisherman so I focused on the fish. I applied some techniques I learned here and relied heavily on that damn Senko for a while.
About halfway through the season I went back to basics and pretended that the Senko didnt exist. I fished the back of the boat in all but one TX and came in 3rd overall. Not bad for a lifetime salt water rat. My best single day was a bit over 9 lbs with a 5 fish limit. Not one of those fish tasted salt all day. All came on traditional crankbaits rolled off a point and into deep water.....and some on Sammies early in the day. From that point on I used nothing but "traditional baits" thrown at "traditional" times. I learned that the $3.50 spinners and buzzers can really catch fish. Its where you throw 'em and how you bring em back that counts. So I have a new found confidence in those, cranks, and some texas rigged tubes that put a few fish in the boat.
Next year I am determined to gain confidence in jigs, tubes, and may even try that deadly favorite of yours.....the Brewers grub and technique.....

Not ALL the details you were looking for but hey........I am no expert.

SC

__________________
Why are a wise man and a wise guy opposites?

Spawn till you die
ESBA

Posted by Scully on 2002 PM:

very difficult for some....

John

For some tournament fisherman, asking them to give up "their secret bait or pattern", is like asking for them to surrender their first born. On second thought, I beleive they would much rather give up their first born. lol

MOST of the fisherman I have been around over the years have been all too eager to share information with you, at least some of the time. From a few you will get the "soup to nuts" version, and from a few others the "half truth", mis-direction tale of deeds. Then there are those who have forgoten where they came from, so to speak.

These guys I refer to as the "Sneaky Petes" of our fishing fraternity. These guys can be found anywhere. They are not just club fisherman, or tournament anglers. Even your everyday average "for fun fisherman" can and will go "mum" on you when you ask him questions he feels will infringe on his fishing success.

They "learned" from someone (as you have) how to go about preparing for a day on the water. I believe many of us have had a "mentor" or that special someone , who along the way was kind enough to pass on to us much of what they knew concerning bass fishing in general. "Sneaky Petes" USE their mentors.

These "internet voyeurs" ask questions, read the posts on this board and other fishing boards, file away what information they feel useful....AND SHARE IT WITH NO ONE. They never post a thread, or answer one informativley. Unfortunately, its the nature of the beast. As much as I love this sport, I must admit, we are a closed mouth group of individuals. Not just TX guys my good friend, all fisherman in general.

Scul

Posted by JOHN G on 2002 PM:

I know Scul, but I am just trying to fan the flames a little here and get some meaningful dialogues going in this offseason....I dont expect a full revealing of all the "secret" as there really aren't too many of them to begin with, just a little more input than has been here....

Scott buddy, thanks a ton, see, that is what I am talking about, you don't have to sell your soul on here....by the way, would love to show you firsthand a good brewers day on my boat next year...

and Earthy, thanks also!!

JOHN G

Posted by Scott C on 2002 PM:

You say the words and I shall be reeled !!!!!

Still waiting to hear from ya...........or do I owe you a call now ?

SC

__________________
Why are a wise man and a wise guy opposites?

Spawn till you die
ESBA

Posted by JPBass on 2002 PM:

Re: You Tourney Guys never cease to Amaze me!!!

quote:

Originally posted by JOHN G
My challenge to all the guys in my eye catching "you are all wimps" post has yet to elicit a single response from an actual winner of any tournament with any details about what and how etc......
JOHN G

I don't know John, I seem to remember quite a few guys coming on and telling the specifics of their winning patterns through the course of the season...... Maybe they just didn't like being called "PUSSY WIMPS!!" LOL

Anyways I won only one tournament this year. It was at Highland Lake in Ct. The pattern was Senkos (dark colors) thrown at shallow (real shallow) rocks and docks in the first bay and where it narrows going into the second. That was in May and it was snowing! If I had the GPS numbers of the rocks I'd give um to ya. No great secrets or revelations here.

I find most tourney guys are more than willing to give up their patterns....................AFTER THE TOURNEY!! LOL

__________________

http://www.renegadebassmasters.com

Posted by wnybassman on 2002 PM:

John,

I drag tubes in May, drown Senkos from June to October, then drag tubes again from then until ice-up, what else do you need to know??

All seriousness aside though, I don't have too many "secrets" to hide. If someone asks, I usually tell. Comes back to bite me sometimes, but that just means they listened well. LOL!

__________________
Bassman's Thread of the Web - A Look at WNY's Bass Fishing

- Protection and organization of your rods

"Perhaps God gave the answers, to those with nothing to say" - Savatage

Posted by JPBass on 2002 PM:

quote:

Originally posted by wnybassman
John,

I drag tubes in May, drown Senkos from June to October, then drag tubes again from then until ice-up, what else do you need to know??

So that means you bring only one rod to a tourney.....Right? LOL

By the way Noel I was just thumbing through my copy of fishlines and saw your name pretty close to the top.

NICE WORK!!!

__________________

http://www.renegadebassmasters.com

Posted by JOHN G on 2002 PM:

Noel only has one setup but he has 10 of the same set up! LOL......really, he has a favorite old casting reel that he collects whenever he can get a hold of one, and when you look in his rod compartment he must have about 8 or 10 them in there....old AbuGarcia Black Max....and in his skillful hands, it is a weapon..

JP, congrats on the win this year!

after I made this silly post, I got on the phone with Scully and we bent each other's ear for about an hour, his presentation at our seminar get together will be top flight and beyond interesting.....

JOHN G

Posted by Scully on 2002 PM:

For JohnG..."Soup to Nuts"

Sorry, see new thread

Posted by wnybassman on 2002 PM:

Thanks JP. 20th last year and 13th this year. So close! Man, with NEXT years schedule, I am drooling!!!

Yeah, I could probably fish most tx's with two rods, not quite sure if I could dwindle it down to one though

John, those old Black Max's serve me well, and they are cheap!!! Especially when people clean out their closets, and just send them to me out of the blue

Posted by jiggin-n-piggin on 2002 AM:

There are no secrets!

quote:

I don't have too many "secrets" to hide

Noel is absolutely right!! I've been tournament fishing since 1989 and find that there really are no secrets. Most of us do pretty much the same stuff. When I finally get to fish with guys that I always wondered about, I find out that they don't do things much differently than I.

I believe that most of the time, it comes down to location, location, location!! The best bait or technique, in the wrong location, won't get you any bites. Generally, the decisions we make in the course of a tournament day, is what wins and loses tournaments.

Stick to what you have confidence in and find a place on the lake that holds fish. Chances are real good that you'll get bit.

C'ya on the water,
Ted

Posted by Paladin on 2002 AM:

My old Tx partner used to say

.All Fishermen are liars except you and me and I am not too sure about you!

__________________
Get the net!

Posted by Scully on 2002 AM:

aahhhh...how refreshing

jig-n-piggin

Thats what I have been trying to teach people for years.......location, location, location. Too many anglers, especially new ones to the sport, are consumed with the concept of a "magic bait". Its akin to putting the perverbial "cart before the horse" scenario. You have to be able to find the fish before you can catch them.

Scully

Posted by Dominic on 2002 PM:

Magic baits make the world go round and the tackle companies rich.

Posted by quantumman29 on 2002 PM:

now now now .........

i DISTINTCLY

Posted by quantumman29 on 2002 PM:

DAMN IT!!!!!!

i DISTINCTLY remember posting many a valueble posts about certain tournament waters and the patterns to which have produced for both myself as well as the patterns that produced for others,i also recall giving distinct directions to certain areas on certain bodies of water that contain an abundance of catchable bass! i have also mentioned that anytime anyone ever needs any assistance on a body of water,if in fact i have had any experinces on that body of water,i would with no problem share any and all help possible, to me,pointing someone in the right direction doesnt always mean they are going to whoop your ass in an event,they still HAVE TO CATCH THE FISH!!!!!!

we all have different skills and techniques,this has been proven many many atime,sit 2 guys in the same boat,same rods,reels,and lures,and believe it or not,1 guy will out fish the other,why? his skills are better then the other guys for that specific pattern and or lure! so it never bothers me to tell anyone where the fish are or what they are hitting,because if your not me,YOUR NOT CATCHING MY FISH!!!! LMAO!

QUANTUMMAN

Posted by CUS on 2002 PM:

Biggest hint I can give someone is learn to read between the lines. Many anglers will tell you things, you may just need to decipher them a little.

In my post to you about Salt City results for 2002, I supplied a website. Our website under the news has pretty much all the tournament results and tells the patterns used to catch the top 3-5 bags.

I'll sum it up for you:

Oneida Lake: end of June. Black/Red Flake Texas rigged tube, off of humps (scattered milfoil) in 6'-8' adjacent to 12'-15'.

Sandy Pond: July after and during a cold front. Black/Red Flakee Texas rigged tube, thick lily pads/milfoil in 2'-3' of water. By the way, same guy won which is why bait was same.

Cayuga Lake: August. White Bill Norman Crankbait, fished in 8'-10' of water with very scattered weeds. Object was to get bait hung up, and rip free to trigger a strike. I won that one (so I you need any more info please let me know). Fished out of the back of the boat on my partners spot, he weighed two small fish (refused to throw a crankbait).

Black Lake: Sept. Tube, Senko, Crankbait, accounted for the winning limit. All came on grass line (outside edge) next to deeper water.

1000 Islands: Oct. Black/Black Jig/Pig 1/2oz. All fish came on rock point, that had scattered milfoil, but was very steep sloped bank. 3' to 20'. Fish moved in and out throughout the day.

Chaumont Bay: Oct. 1/4 oz. Texas Rigged BPS Tube (watermelon). accounted for 4 of the limit. 1 smallie came in 8' with scattered large clumps of milfoil and rock piles. 3 largemouth including two 4#'s came out of 2'-3' of water, sand bottom with scattered milfoil (thinner was better) and mixed in rock. Originally my boat partner had found those fish in 8' to 10' but when they weren't there I suggested moving in first, (then deeper if need be). I was fortunate to basically sight fish and saw my biggest bass go over and eat the tube. One largemouth came on a Senko early in the day.

As the day progressed, the fish actually moved shallower.

Any other questions about what the top finishers did, ask or check out the website.

http://sport.syracuse.com/cc/saltcitybass

cus

Posted by Charlie on 2002 AM:

Making sweeping "generalizations" about tournament fishing does not help anyone who wants information.

When I first started fishing in the US I was fishing for "any fish" with livebait, bread, cheese etc. NOBODY EVER told me to try anything special, fish in a certain spot or how to make the fish jump into my net (this was before I got my boat).
Cold hard fact is, nobody became a success by giving away the formula! You learn by your mistakes and you become a better fisherman/woman because of them!

I will give any information to anyone who asks. People on this website who have fished with me when I am running the boat will tell you that I will stop fishing myself, to help them catch fish. I can't tell you how many times, my non-boater has kicked my butt because I gave them the bait/lure, told them the retrieve, where to cast and how to present the lure/s!
Members of Atlantic BASS will tell you that I have given members information on lakes that I have fished and they have finished in the top 3 based on that imformation.

Anyone wants to know how I won Greenwood, Candlewood and others, including B.A.S.S. lunker on 1000 Islands, just ask me.

Please. no more generalizations. It's not nice and it makes those of us who do share information shy away from helping others in future.

Tight Lines!

Charlie

__________________
Naturalized American (yeah baby)Tournament Angler, Journalist and New York State Guide # 2803
Occasional Tournament Director!
"Come with me and I will make you Fishers of Men"

Posted by Scully on 2002 AM:

it was a fun post....

Charlie

John was ONLY joking around to get a rise out of some of the guys.

Happy Holidays.

Ray

PS...You never gave me any info....lol Then again, I didnt ask.

Posted by Charlie on 2002 PM:

HI Ray! Happy Holidays to you.

I understand the "humor" but the words "fan the flame" did just that.

Perhaps if we stop beating up on the "same old subjects" like Senko's and Tournament Anglers we would all get along and share everything we know, which in my case would take about 5 minutes!

Tight Lines!

Charlie

__________________
Naturalized American (yeah baby)Tournament Angler, Journalist and New York State Guide # 2803
Occasional Tournament Director!
"Come with me and I will make you Fishers of Men"

Posted by Woody on 2002 AM:

Welome back Charles

How did you Win Candlewood, Greenwood and the lunker at 1000 Islands?
Regards,
Woody

Posted by JOHN G on 2002 AM:

yes, Charles, I would love also to see a long post on that, please!!

Scul is right, I was snapping on you guys to light the fire and I did!

Part of my "job" here also, is to be a spinmeister of sorts.....

JOHN G

Posted by Charlie on 2002 AM:

Hey Woodster! Thanks, it is always good to come back after a hectic year and get abused on NYBass... I love you guys!

Candlewood.

Jerkbait (Kevin Van Dam ,clown color) fished over beds in the north east section of the lake. Mostly bays that had protection from a southly wind which was blowing hard that day.
Retrieve was snap, snap, pause, snap, pause. Caught lunker on a 4 inch rainbow trout Senko fished horizontally to the docks in Lattins Cove.

Greenwood.
Top water popper (RICO) 15 bass but only 2 keepers.
Fished the north east section (see a pattern here guys?) till 12 noon. Ran the full length of the lake and fished by the marina (DeFeos) when I caught one more fish. Ran up the creek about 300 yards and fished the south west shoreline with a 5 inch pumpkinseed Senko with the tail dipped in chartreause and got lunker.

1000 Islands
We ran the main river south of the launch to Lake of the Isles. I noticed the size of the baitfish and did not have anything in my tackle box that was that small except a Rocket Shad. I tied it on and hit a monster fish (either a Muskie or a very big Northern) so I lost that fish but I managed to keep the lure somehow!

I re-tied, and made a huge cast to clear the spool. I had barely turned the handle and the smallmouth hit the bait. I set the hook on a 7'6" G.Loomis spinnerbait rod with my arms over my head which equates to a 14 foot high hook set! The fish jumped immediately and I knew it was big, because I could see the fish from 30 yards away! The wind was howling and Tim Carini who was my partner that day did an outstanding job of keeping the boat still while I played this fish. When she was finally in the boat, I could not stop shaking. I knew there and then, that she would make lunker. Weight 5lb 7oz... What a fish from the river!

More information with a $5.00 donation can be sent to: Charlie Stuart........................... Just kiddin!

Tight Lines
Charlie

__________________
Naturalized American (yeah baby)Tournament Angler, Journalist and New York State Guide # 2803
Occasional Tournament Director!
"Come with me and I will make you Fishers of Men"

Posted by Woody on 2002 AM:

Thanks Charlie...

Just a few more???
What time of the year were the events at Greenwood and Candlewood?
What about the 1000 Island Lunker?
Was it the Larger Version of the Rico or smaller?
Do you find a difference in the smaller Rico and a Sugoi Splash?
It is good to see you back !!!!
Regards,
Woody

Posted by Charlie on 2002 AM:

Hey Woody!

Candlewood was May, Greenwood was August, 1000 Islands was September.

I use the 3 1/2 inch RICO. To me it is THE premium top water popper style lure.
I do not have a Sugoi, however I hear they are great also, but I have caught SO many bass on the RICO that I would have to be VERY impressed to switch.
Tight Lines!
Charlie

__________________
Naturalized American (yeah baby)Tournament Angler, Journalist and New York State Guide # 2803
Occasional Tournament Director!
"Come with me and I will make you Fishers of Men"

Posted by Woody on 2002 PM:

Excellent Job All Around....

Continued success in all your endeavors!!!!!
I have to say it is pretty cool seeing your name in Bassmaster.
Oh, and I guess I owe you a Five Spot...
Best,
Woody

Posted by Charlie on 2002 PM:

Thanks Woody!

I just got a Christmas gift in the mail this morning! A B.A.S.S. Lunker Trophy! Can't believe how awesome that looks... My wife bought me down to earth by remining me that it cost about $50,000 in entry fees to get that piece of timber!!! LOL smart girl ( damn if I had pushed her overboard 10 years ago, I would be out now for good behavior!!)

Charlie

__________________
Naturalized American (yeah baby)Tournament Angler, Journalist and New York State Guide # 2803
Occasional Tournament Director!
"Come with me and I will make you Fishers of Men"

Posted by phil colarusso on 2002 PM:

I'll talk!!!

It`s true we do try to keep things to our self.I myself spend three to four days on the water. I try diffrent things.I try to find things that work and forget about the things that don`t. Last summer I was fishing a two day tournament on saratoga lake .the first morning I went to breakline fish .i`ts a shallow flat that has a strait drop off.I though worms and 1/4 oz homemade jigs I caught a pair of 3# fish and one 5# all largemouth. then ran to a second spot my none boater had .It was another shallow flat, but it was rock and weed.A perfect early spot.I picked up a senko blk red flake.about fourth cast,I picked up another 5# lg mouth.My partner was putting on a show for her self.She started to cull three lb fish.Then I caught another fish on my jig,about two lbs. I did some more running around,and made the decision to ,sit in a weed bed that had big fish,and try to cull the 2lb fish flipping 7in worms and jigs,I about 10 feet of water,.The last five minutes of the day I had a monster on the jig.He got wrapped up in the weeds and I could`nt do anything,it was gone.The end of the day 1, I was in first. Day two A slick HOT day. I tryed to run the same pattern as the day before. I pulled to the first spot and made three passes,and caught two 14in fish. Then ran to one of my favorite spots a small rock pile covered with milfoil.I picked up the 7 in power worm and caught four small fish in ten minutes. Having a limit I ran to a spot that had all two plus lb fish, a small jet of weeds in ten ft of water.I made two passes and caught sixteen bass all under two lbs.A hour to go flippen time, the last run A small thick clump of weeds in six ft of water. I picked up the worm and caught another ten or more dinks.Time for weight in, thinking of what else I could of done. I ended up winning and had big fish of the day. One of the most important things is to be willing to move. If I stayed in the same spots I might not of won.

__________________
Phil colarusso